MEL #056 | From Curious Student to Global Engineering Leader through a Relentless Focus on Adding Value with François Payen

PAYEN (00:00)

Knowing about who they are, what is important for them, and knowing what is important for my team members and letting them know that you really care for them, but also you want to focus on delivering results. And when a crisis comes, it becomes easier to manage.

ADAMS (00:42)

In this episode, I speak with Francois Payen, supply aftermarket leader for master data management at Trane Technologies. Francois discovered engineering early, encouraged by a father who pushed him ahead in math and science. He chose chemical engineering for both passion and opportunity, then launched his career at Alcoa before moving across industries from metals to aerospace to lithium and now data leadership. Along the way, he kept building skills, earning certifications, completing executive education,

and stepping into bigger leadership roles focused on adding value to the business. In our leadership segment, Francois recounts how he faced a defining moment when a massive fire broke out at his lithium manufacturing site. With millions of dollars per day at stake, he had to stay calm, assemble cross-functional teams, and rely on trusted relationships to stabilize the situation. Through composure, collaboration, and decisive action, he helped guide the recovery and rebuild operations in phases.

Francois’s advice to aspiring engineering leaders, think beyond technical work and focus on solving other people’s problems. He believes leadership is about helping others succeed, giving credit generously and continuously learning. Most importantly, he reminds us that delivering results while caring for people is what ultimately defines strong leadership. Explore the full episode summary, including guest bio, key takeaways, transcript and recommended resources in the show notes at drangeliqueadams.com slash podcast.

Without further delay, here is my conversation with Francois Payen.

ADAMS (02:15)

Hi Francois. Welcome to Mastering Engineering Leadership.

PAYEN (02:18)

Thank you, thank you, it’s a pleasure to be here and thank you for inviting me here.

ADAMS (02:21)

I’m thrilled to have you here. Can you start by telling us how you got into engineering as a career path?

PAYEN (02:26)

Yes, so ⁓ for me, it started in elementary school. My dad would always tutor me in the summertime and also doing a lot of ⁓ homework with me throughout the year. And what that did, it gave me a good advance knowledge of what was coming in the next year since when I was in elementary school. And then because of that,

it gives me confidence to keep on pushing and I always did very well in all of my math courses. And then when I get to high school, I started taking physics and chemistry and I fell in love with physics and chemistry. And then later on, I decided to go into chemical engineering. At a time I did not know what chemical engineering was.

but I decided to just go start a chemical engineering.

ADAMS (03:21)

Same here, by the way, I also chose chemical engineering, not really knowing what it was.

Did you find that once you got into chemical engineering that you actually liked it?

PAYEN (03:30)

I did a search and I knew I could do any of the engineering ⁓ that I wanted to do, but I checked as well and saw that chemical engineering was top paid among all the engineering that I could have chosen. And then I said, you know what, I will choose chemical engineering since I love chemistry and I love math at the same time. And I ended up liking chemical engineering very much.

My first role was working at Alcoa and there I get to do a lot of different things, learning about different processes. And later on I ended up changing that because I didn’t like chemical engineering, but I really enjoy what I was doing in my first few jobs.

ADAMS (04:13)

Yeah, talk a little bit more about your career trajectory. So of course, you and I met at Alcoa. that’s where that’s where we met, but you continued on and changed different different industries. So can you tell us a little bit about that?

PAYEN (04:24)

Yeah, so my first job, like we said, I went to school in New York University and I got my chemical engineering degree. And after that, I applied for grad school and I got into grad school at the University of Wisconsin and I was in a PhD program there. And I decided that

I would apply for jobs and that year there was a conference in Indianapolis when I was in Madison, Wisconsin. I drove to Indianapolis to that conference and I said, if I find a job, I will just quit the PhD program and start working. And I applied and one of the companies that gave me an offer was Alcoa and that offer was very well compared to

what I was making in grad school. And also it gave me the opportunity to go work in Canada and as part of a rotational program. So I chose to go there to work as a process engineer for Alcoa.

ADAMS (05:25)

So remind me which of Alcoa’s Canadian operations were you at?

PAYEN (05:29)

I ended up working in the one in Deschambault and also for the one in Becacour

ADAMS (05:36)

Okay, okay. So you were both Deschambault and Becancour okay. And then after you left Alcoa, can you talk a little bit more about the other different jobs that you’ve had?

PAYEN (05:45)

So after Alcoa, at the end of my rotation, I had to choose between going to a place called Bai Comeau that is about eight hours north of Montreal, or go back to the US and work in Louisiana. So I chose to go back to Louisiana. And then from there, I worked for Alcoa for some time. And after, I switched to a different company, still in the smelting industry.

And there I was working as a process development engineer overseeing R &D for five different sites. And from there, I continued to work on process improvement. And after that, I ended up going to work, I switched to aerospace and I started working for Cullen Aerospace.

At the time, think the name was UTC, UTAS, UTC aerospace systems, and it became Colin aerospace. So when I was in Colin aerospace, I worked as a senior quality engineer and I got a chance to work with a VP of supplier quality. And there I learned a lot about quality and it was a change for me as a chemical engineer.

and working at a chemical plant, now I went to work in a site that is slightly different from a typical chemical plant. And I got to interact a lot with executive teams and learn how to effectively communicate and also seeing the value of… And also seeing how adding value to the business is very important.

and see every step of the way, how to manage data and how to manage processes and how all of those come together to help the company make more money.

ADAMS (07:33)

Yeah, that’s great. And I definitely want to talk more about this perspective that you got about adding value to the business. But before we jump there, I’m curious about this transition from Alcoa, is a certain type of manufacturing in a certain industry. Then you switch over to aerospace, a very different industry. I’m curious just how you made that leap. Did you find things were actually pretty similar from the fundamental standpoint, or did you have to

go about learning a completely different set of tools that you could use to be effective in this new role.

PAYEN (08:06)

That’s a very good question. When I was in the previous companies that I worked for Alcoa, I had started and went back to take my black belt, Lensix Sigma black belt. And there I saw how I could use this and quality and decided to look for a different position. And at the time as well, I was looking to move closer

North that was in Louisiana, I wanted to move closer enough and toward New York area. But I did not end up going to New York. I stopped in North Carolina, and that’s where the company was. And since then, I stayed in North Carolina and we enjoyed the position that I had there. And there’s a lot of similarities that the techniques that we learned, the skills that we have as an engineer, they’re transferable.

So transferring to an aerospace company, it was slightly different and there is more regulations and also seeing how quality can impact ⁓ the business. And if there is a huge mess in our processes, it can have huge impact on, let’s say on airplane. And also we work on military equipment and these are very important equipment that we worked on.

And it’s very useful to see how what we do can impact the real world.

ADAMS (09:26)

Yeah, I like what you what you said about a lot of transferable skills, you know, and certainly Lean Six Sigma. I mean, that’s nearly universal. I think principles in terms of quality and process control and really important engineering principles. it sounds like that was an important stepping stone for you. But then you say there are some differences in your industry, too. It’s regulated very differently.

the impact of certain aspects of quality, different clients or customers, should say, manufacturing versus defense and things like that. So you got a really good, I think broad overview of some very different industries. And then as you said earlier, you also really started to clearly understand.

how important it is to add value to the business. So can you talk a little bit more about those insights and then how you built upon those as you continue through your career trajectory?

PAYEN (10:20)

Very good question here again. I remember one thing that happened during my first job returning from Quebec to work in a plant in Louisiana. when, I think there was my first, the first interview that I had, I went to the plant in Louisiana. And then from there, I met with a plant manager and the plant manager asked me, do you know what we make here? And.

I did my homework and I started talking about the aluminum process and when it started and the different steps to get to making aluminum. And at the end, he said, nope, that’s not what we make. And he said to me, we make money. And since then, it gives me a different perspective to see when we work, we don’t just work, we don’t just go to work and do things because we want to do them.

It’s because we are adding value, not only adding value for the company and also the customers that we are serving, and also seeing how we can make a difference in the world. And the way that we do that is working on key projects and showing why we should have this project in the first place. And why should we improve our processes and adding value for the whole company overall.

ADAMS (11:35)

Yeah, I love what you said there. So first of all, that’s very Alcoa. I’m not surprised at all that the plate manager was like, nope, we make money. That’s a very Alcoa mindset and one that I kept with me as well. And so, you know, I think that that serves you well when you’re in the corporate environment. It’s interesting for me now that I’m in academia and that’s not the mindset. so sometimes I’m sitting in meetings. like, okay, we might need to think about this a little bit differently. But, and also what you said really resonated too about

really being able to communicate the value that you are bringing with the projects, why this project is important, why it’s adding value and just developing that skillset. Well, actually it’s two things. It’s a mindset, first of all, that this is what you need to do because that’s why we’re here. And then the second is a skillset to actually be able to do that effectively. so very important and particularly for my listeners, which are very…

a lot of them are very early career, they might even still be in school, really important to get those mindsets early on and those skills early on and it will serve you very well. So talk a little bit more about what else you have been up to Francois in your career.

PAYEN (12:38)

So after the airspace experience that I had, I went to work for a company called Life at a Time. And currently their name, they were bought by a different company. They were bought by Rio Tinto. And that site, I got to become the PMO leader and engineering leader for the site. There I learned to…

manage other people. As an engineer, never really wanted to manage other people and manage teams. And now I had an experience to oversee a huge manufacturing site and where the site makes about half a billion dollars a year in revenue. And from there, I had multiple teams reporting to me, process engineers and

project managers, construction managers, and we oversee building of small plants and R &D facilities and also manage all of the capital projects for the whole site. And that’s where I started loving managing teams and solving problems as I do that. And from there, I became very interested in keep on learning. For example,

When I was at that company, I was negotiating contracts and hiring project managers and also negotiating with the engineering firms, the rates for their engineers. And that gave me the opportunity to go to take a class at Wharton Business School. And I took a first negotiation course there.

And then after that, I use those negotiation skills that I learned to convince my leaders to allow me to do a general management program from Wharton Business School. And I ended up completing that. And from there, I learned so much in terms of the vision that we have for the teams and where the company is going and the ability to move from one industry to the next. And also,

again, adding value for the companies. And from there, I ended up going to ⁓ make another switch to the current company that I work for, where now I lead what we call master data management for trained technologies. And I lead all of the execution of the, what we call the after supply, after market business.

I lead all of the execution for master data management. So that helped me touch on a different part of the business.

That involves really focusing on ensuring the accuracy, the consistency and the governance of the organization’s critical data, such as customer data, supplier data and employee data. And from there, I lead some of the transformational projects that we have contributing by working with different teams.

and all of that to again add value for our customers and for our investors.

ADAMS (15:38)

So I love this last transition, because once again, you are switching functions, maybe in even industries a little bit. you haven’t said yet how, if at all, you’ve got this rich data analytics background in terms of your academic pedigree. And so what I’m curious to know is how are you learning, at least whatever you need to know to be really…

effective in this role, but my guess is, and you can tell me if I’m wrong, that they hired you because you have this leadership and value focus. And that’s what they were looking for in a leader of this type of role. And that you, I’m sure have subject matter experts that are in your organization who really understand the data and the data management and things like that. please tell me exactly how that has worked out for you.

PAYEN (16:23)

Yeah. So when I started working for Alacoa, part of what I was doing is collecting data on some of the improvement work that we were doing. And since my first wall in Alacoa, I get involved in analyzing data. And then when I moved to the next wall, it’s also handling a lot of customer data.

and a lot of the vendors that we are analyzing. And in the aerospace industry as well, I get to create a lot of the dashboards for the VP that I was working for, where he was overseeing about seven different business units and seeing about 5,000 suppliers and reporting on quality data. And that helps me learn on the job how to

pull the data, analyze it. And also when I move to the next wall, it’s still in the chemical industry, I help implement what we call, I have implement Power BI across the whole company. And that gives me an opportunity to learn how to implement softwares across multiple sites and also multiple countries.

And because I speak Spanish as well, that helped me. One of our big sites that we have that was in Argentina, working with those employees there, it helped build good relationships with them as well. So I implemented other softwares as well in that role as a PMO leader and engineering site leader. One thing I can tell you, it was not my role primarily to implement softwares.

but I saw the need and no one was doing it. And I convinced my leaders that I can do it. And I went and got it done and delivered results. And I find a lot of satisfaction in working with data as well. Even though I was working on chemical processes, but pulling all of the data, implementing project management software and implementing data analytics software that

helped me build that background. And I wanted to make a switch during COVID time. And I started learning as well. I went back to school. I did a program with MIT where it was in ⁓ technologies and technology and operations. And it was a great learning for me. And there I learned how to manage technical teams. That was one of the courses that I took.

So all of those learnings plus real-life experience at work helped me build that background. And when I get to this current position that I am now, I already knew how to get the work done and I had the right skills to help me succeed. And for example, when I first started and we implemented a few changes and… ⁓

quickly after I think about six months and we had huge improvement in terms of reducing our cycle time. And the teams that report to me directly ended up winning a presidential award for the work that they have been doing under my leadership.

ADAMS (19:43)

Francois, can you give us an example of how you use leadership skills in your work?

PAYEN (19:47)

All right, I remember something that happened. I still remember the date, June 26, 2023. And that day started like any other day. And that quickly changed when I received an urgent message. Something serious was happening at the manufacturing site where I was working. And moments later, a team member told me to check the news, which I did. And what I saw left me both very concerned and also determined.

because there is a massive fire raging in our plant at the time. And with all the local news, I’m broadcasting live from the scene. And at that moment, it wasn’t just a building that was on fire. It was our people. It was the community and also the impact this could have on the supply chain for the electric coal, ⁓ for the electric core industry at the time, because we were making lithium. And as a site,

engineering leader, I knew this was a defining moment for me. So what I did on my way to the plant, about five minutes away from the plant, was police, I found police barricading the entrance and I explained who I was and I told them that I was the engineering leader for the site and responsible for safety and operation. And they let me through. As I approached, the fire was still ongoing.

and the warehouse and the shipping area and it would burn for a few days. And that site, was a huge site, about 300 teammates, ⁓ employees there and it’s huge, about 900 acres. And like I said, they made about half a billion dollars in revenue for the site. And in that moment, I realized that I had to keep my composure. And if I panics,

so would those around me. So remaining calm under pressure was my first act of leadership.

ADAMS (21:34)

What did you actually do to try to stay calm? Were you like deep breathing or just talking to yourself? I’m just curious if you recall in that moment, how were you managing to keep it under control?

PAYEN (21:47)

Typically, I have a positive view on things and I say, will be fine, making sure that no one gets hurt. And generally, I do very well under pressure. I don’t panic that easily. And I always keep a positive ⁓ view on how things will turn out to be. And that’s basically what I did. And when I get there, I looked at what was going on and saw that no one got hurt.

Thank God no one got hurt during that incident.

ADAMS (22:16)

Yeah, that’s, that’s amazing.

Okay, so you get there and you already know, all right, I’ve got to remain calm. And you also know that nobody got injured. So those are your first two things. So take us through the rest of the situation.

PAYEN (22:29)

Yeah. So I quickly assemble a cross-functional emergency team for the onsite assessment and also to assess the damage that was, that is still ongoing and also launch a full wood cause analysis and full investigation. And this, this is, this is very huge. It was very huge for the site. We would lose about $1.5 million per day based on our, based on our productions and how much

we produce in terms of lithium. And I reached out to three of the trusted engineering firms that I worked with before. And I can tell you that trust wasn’t built overnight. It came from years of strong partnership and working with those leaders from those companies. And because of those relationships, each firm sent their best engineers within hours of our request.

And their first task was to assess the structural safety of the damaged building so we can make informed decisions quickly about demolition and recovery. And we also engage a disaster recovery company to help bring power back and initiate a cleanup and began planning for long-term journey of

of normal operation.

ADAMS (23:44)

So talk about, talk a little bit about these relationships. You mentioned it. And, and I think it’s really important for, people to understand how important it is to build strong collaborative relationships cross functionally in your industry. Not necessarily because you’re like, well, in case of emergency, need somebody to call, but just because that is really good business and it gives you a support system that

that can potentially help you out when there’s all sorts of big and small fluctuations in business that can happen where you may have to rely on trusted partners to bail you out of a jam. Now, this one was catastrophic, potentially catastrophic, it sounds like in this case. And so you relied really heavily on these relationships you had built.

but there can be minor fluctuations in supply chain or there can be a weather event or there can be all situations where you may need to rely on a trusted partner or trusted collaborator to say, can you help me out here? So can you just talk a little bit about how you go about building relationships with your partners?

PAYEN (24:53)

It starts with the first meeting that you have with those companies. When you first meet, at least that’s what I do, when I first meet with them, I treat them with respect. And also I had to negotiate with those engineering firms and the way I treat them in the past, they know that I will not do anything that would hurt their business. And I always find a way to…

create win-win situations, both for us and also for them. And as you build those relationships, it helps you have a personal connection with those people. And then when you call them, they’re not just doing something for your company. In a way, they are doing it for you. And that’s what I have. In the case of those engineering firms, that’s what I was able to build. And there is one of the people there. He was in a routine doctor’s appointment.

And he finished very quickly and he was off of work that same day. He said, you know what, I’m coming. And because they work with me before and they work with my team before. that just started way back. Not just when we make the first phone call.

ADAMS (25:59)

Absolutely. so yeah, finish telling. I keep interrupting you, but I have all these questions. finish the story and tell us about how it ended.

PAYEN (26:07)

Yeah. So with lithium being a critical mineral, our site immediately became the focus of multiple government agencies and corporations with investigators was top importance for us and also balancing transparency and the regulatory requirements. The decision was made collaboratively with the experts and the engineers and authorities to let the fire burn.

because it was lithium, you don’t want to put people at rest. And then after that, we would demolish what remained. And this was only possible to clear and continuous communication and ⁓ alignment with all of those stakeholders. And meanwhile, I had to ⁓ reallocate resources to two funds, the demolition and the rebuilding.

And in parallel, I entered into negotiation with the insurers and to ensure coverage for immediate losses and also for business continuity. And later we ⁓ brought specialist, special consultants to handle ongoing communications and documentation with the insurance partners. So what we did, our approach was for the recovery.

was done in phases and days we restored power with temporary units to enable essential functions and within weeks we began restoring power and utilities necessary for normal plant operations. And then the longer term was to rebuild the warehouse and also replace all of the ⁓ lost equipment and that involved coordinating with dozens of teams and vendors.

each phase demanded detailed planning and also clear communication, adaptability and resilience. So I learned that no recovery plan is perfect. It’s how quickly you can adapt and learn that matters the most. So if I reflect back on that through this experience,

I see that it’s very important, like I said, to maintain composure and chaos and building trust long before any disaster strike in this case. also collaborating with our partners, government and our own teams is very important because if you don’t have that collaborative effort, it will be very hard to get resolved very quickly. And also

making rapid and high-stake decisions, you have to be very careful, but also trust the people that you’re working with, the engineers, that information they are giving you, that you trust and verify that they are correct and move ahead. And most of all, it’s really about caring for the people in our teams, in our community, and also focus on the mission that we need to ⁓ keep pushing forward.

even though we’re in the middle of a crisis.

ADAMS (28:52)

Yeah, and I wanted to touch on what you talked about about caring for people. you I have been in a couple of situations myself where there have been high stakes. You’re losing money. you mentioned like a million some a day and tensions really high, but you’ve got to maintain a team and maintain this environment such that one, people are giving you their all, Their discretionary time.

Two, people are giving you honest information, even though they may be worried that they may be seen as at fault or moving too slow, just all sorts of emotional issues happening during times like this. And then of course you’ve got to regulate your own emotions, which it sounds like was not a hard for you, because you’re naturally calm and positive, which is great. So can you talk a little bit about how you helped the team to maintain

positive momentum, maintain honesty, maintain trust with each other during this sustained period of a crisis.

PAYEN (29:52)

So one thing I would say is the empowerment for the people in the teams. For the people in the teams is really ⁓ to enable them to act and also turning those crisis into some leadership opportunities for them and is allowing them to take responsibility for part of the issue and also making sure that you don’t point fingers at them.

there is a crisis, let’s solve it. Let’s focus on solving the problem and not pointing fingers at anyone. And also the trust that you build over time is very important because you never know when a crisis will come, right? So it’s really the day to day when you talk to people, the way you talk to them. People in my team.

most of the time we go to lunch together during lunch break when we have time to go to lunch. And it’s those communications, knowing about who they are, what is important for them, and knowing what is important for my team members and letting them know that you really care for them, but also you want to focus on delivering results. And when a crisis comes, it becomes easier to manage. And also they know that

I am a very ethical person and always operate with transparency and accountability. And these are some key areas where it is very important to have the people to trust you and also empower people in your team so they can make decision. And if things don’t go well at first, it’s okay, we can learn from it.

and we minimize the impact it has on the business and also making sure that no one is getting hurt.

ADAMS (31:43)

All right, Francois, as we wrap up, what advice do you have for engineers who are interested in pursuing leadership roles?

PAYEN (31:49)

I would say it’s very important to think of other people when you want to go into leadership. Think about how you can solve other people’s problems. And I deeply believe that saying somewhere it says, is more blessed to give than to receive. And many people will talk about the law of reciprocity. And when you do things for other people and when you make them look good, it’s very

very important and at that time you will be very successful as a leader. And if you help others, others will tend to help you back and also giving credit to other people and people in your team ⁓ managing up and across. It’s very important to think about those things and also always keep on learning. If there is something you don’t know how to do it.

Go learn. Most companies now, they allow you to keep on learning and they will pay for everything for you to learn if you can justify why you should go. And also keep on reading. There are a few key books you can read to help you with your leadership journey. And I would say it is very important as a leader, we have to focus on the mission.

and delivering results is very important. If we do everything while we do not deliver results, it’s not good enough.

ADAMS (33:06)

Francois, thank you so much for sharing your insights with us today.

PAYEN (33:09)

Thank you very much. been a pleasure.